I live in the area where this article covers, though not Amish nor related to Amish.

First of all, no one is expelled for disagreeing. And Amish regularly leave with no issues nor problems, making that decision before adult baptism. We know lots of people who do that. They still happily and friendly live next to and interact with Amish.

The problem (shunning) tends to come if Amish leave after baptism but I have yet to hear anyone expelled for disagreeing on issues.

As for children working condition protection, what do you think Amish children / teenagers do? They primarily do lots of household chores, certainly more than regular American kids but they do it with their parents and their siblings. Amish are not focused on making lots of money and they tend to do things at home so it's far unlike factory farms or third world factories one might imagine.

As for woman being poorly treated, it's quite rare for anyone, man or woman, to be poorly treated, attacked, demeaned, etc. among the Lancaster Amish from what I have seen and heard. I think what you are getting at its restriction of typical American freedoms. But the same goes for Amish men. Going out for beers with your buddies, getting a girlfriend on the side, building a corporate career, doing a YC tech startup, hanging out on a boat / yachet, etc. are all no goes for men. It's certainly not for everyone.

I would encourage you to check it out, it's less than 3 hours away from NYC and it's quite an experience. You might be surprised about how happy and fulfilled the Amish in Lancaster are.

Net/net, the article perpetuates a generally positive impression of Amish life because Amish in Lancaster generally have a positive / fulfilling life.

I grew up near Lancaster, got my first drivers license there. I am Pennsylvania Dutch, so am related to them. My parents now live in Chautauqua, NY. I often go to the Amish to purchase leather, quilts, and food. I don't think they are evil, and I don't think that people (women) are necessarily unhappy in that community.

Lancaster is practically cosmopolitan compared to the Amish of Ohio and Western NY. So they are less restrictive than Amish of other areas. In general they have always been kind people in all of my interactions.

That being said, I do think that children have a false choice when they are offered to go live in the outside community. They have an 8th grade education. They might be able to get very manual labor jobs, but are most likely incapable of getting a college degree, without a lot of support. And chores are one thing, but when we talk about a lot of the other work on a farm we aren't looking at just cleaning up your room. Focusing on children alone, I think that community is one which does not even give their children an option of existing in the real world, without a ton of struggle.

>> but are most likely incapable of getting a college degree, without a lot of support

You could say the same of trailer park kids.

I wouldn't expect Amish adults to know how to live in a non-Amish way, how do you expect them to teach that to their children?

If they had all the things you expect people to have, they wouldn't be called Amish, they'd be your neighbours.

You talk with judgement if Amish life is a negative thing. It's how some people live. Let's not dislodge them from it.

How would you like to be told your way of life is enabled by a government that plunders resources overseas, in a nation that was built on the back of slavery and robbing of natives? Not very nice, is it? It's how you live and you like to live how you like to live. Same with the Amish.

>> but are most likely incapable of getting a college degree, without a lot of support

> You could say the same of trailer park kids.

Yes, but you would have a hard time finding an article fetishizing the idyllic, back-to-basics, cultural lifestyle of trailer parks. People generally recognize those conditions are crappy.

> You talk with judgement if Amish life is a negative thing. It's how some people live. Let's not dislodge them from it.

It is a negative thing. Yes, I'm sure some Amish are happy, and that's fine for them. But those who aren't, don't have a real choice to leave.

> How would you like to be told your way of life is enabled by a government that plunders resources overseas, in a nation that was built on the back of slavery and robbing of natives? Not very nice, is it? It's how you live and you like to live how you like to live.

I am working to change my government, and if I were capable I'd work to change the Amish community. Injustice perpetrated by my government doesn't make injustice perpetrated by the Amish community okay.

>> I am working to change my government

That's fine for you. But other people trying to change your way of life, they are called extremists.

Trying to change how other people live will only cause suffering. Look at the millions of displaced in Iraq, Syria, Libya, where the West attempted regime change because of injustice (as they claim).

Injustice perpetrated by the Amish community should be left up to members of Amish community to change.

The Amish have a tradition called Rumspringa where teens are given a year of freedom to do anything they want after which they can choose to come back and be Amish or go their own way. Basically, a bunch of kids are sent off into the world with no sex education and told to do whatever they want. Obviously a lot of them come back pregnant or with STDs or drug habits. And with little education and no resources outside the Amish, the choice isn't real; there's no way for them to realistically choose to leave the Amish community. And if somehow they do manage to get enough resources to leave, they can look forward to being ostracized by their friends and family.

Saying that is bad doesn't mean I'm an extremist.

I'm not suggesting we go into Amish communities and overthrow their leaders. I'm just saying I don't think we should fetishize or support their way of life, which is harmful to many who live in it, and we should provide support for people seeking to leave the Amish community.

Pennsylvania Dutch Unite!

I am one as well, and let me tell you: It's hard to be angry at them when you've had a full Brown Breakfast with Scrapple, creamed chipped beef, eggs, bacon, sausage and pancakes. OMG, heaven.

My knowledge of Amish lifestyle comes from the book Growing up Amish. I really don't think most Amish people, including women, will agree with what you are saying. It's a deliberately different lifestyle and different set of belief system which might look operassive to someone living in American city but those values are very dearly held by those people, both men and women.

I think this oversimplifies it. I didn't grow up Amish, but I grew up in a tiny Anabaptist denomination that had a lot of cultural similarities with the Amish (but technology was allowed).

While it could be true that "those values are very dearly held by those people" you are not counting those who grew up Amish and left (or were expelled) because the values were not dearly held.

Speaking of my own experience growing up Anabaptist, I witnessed misogyny (women were not allowed to teach men) and a forced social cohesion that bordered on cult-like (people had to vow to follow very serious rules, including never to visit any other denomination, and pledge themselves to the denomination, and if they committed a "sin unto death" they were excommunicated from the community with no chance for reconciliation).

I can say with confidence that although there were some aspects of my religious upbringing that I appreciated, overall it was a bad religion that did not bring the best out of people.